THE JOURNEY & FUTURE OF UNIVERSAL CENTURY GUNDAM ③
Interview and Text by Shino Kokawa

Amuro and Kamille: Two Near-Perfect Gundam Protagonists

――Light of Life featured many scenes from Mobile Suit Zeta Gundam. You’ve mentioned that Zeta was the first Gundam series you watched in real-time. Compared to the original, Zeta has a far more complex web of conflicts and wartime scenarios woven into its story. I think that’s what gives it a timeless realism.

Fukui: Absolutely, it’s just like the ongoing conflicts in the Middle East. Especially post-2001, Zeta’s narrative structure has become more relatable.

――Back then, did people see Zeta as a sort of caricature of real-world terrorism and war?

Fukui: Maybe there was a vague sense of that, even then. Zeta aired in ’85, during the tail end of the Cold War between the US and Soviet Union, while the Berlin Wall was still standing. The notion of terrorist groups challenging nation-states wasn’t really a thing yet, but… I don’t know. At the time, I was watching a lot of Japanese movies about the Zenkyōtō movement, so rather than a commentary on global structures, I saw it more as a caricature of Japan in that era. That’s how I perceived it as a high schooler. The Zenkyōtō movement essentially reached out to young people who were disillusioned with the world, questioning if they should just fall in line and become salarymen after graduation. It told them, “No, society is broken. There’s another path.” But once they got pulled in, what happened? They were handed sticks to battle riot police, and as things got uglier, people with different ideologies started killing each other. You could still feel the aftershocks of that world back then. Walk past Meiji University in Ochanomizu, and you’d see these huge signboards about the Narita Airport protests. So yeah, I think I watched Zeta with that connection in mind. Pretty early on, I realized that Kamille, this kid, got swept up into a pointless conflict that could only spiral into infighting.

――How would you assess Amuro Ray from the original Mobile Suit Gundam and Kamille Bidan from Zeta, the two lead characters who defined early Gundam?

Fukui: As protagonists, in terms of introducing the audience to their world while living out their own stories, I’d say both are darn near perfect. Fans have such a strong affinity for Amuro because he genuinely embodied the classic romantic hero archetype, with the story’s core values rooted in that romanticism we talked about earlier. Sure, in the context of mecha anime at the time, a shy, angsty protagonist like Amuro was a rarity. But people don’t just watch anime, you know? For folks who saw Gundam as part of a broader media diet, a reserved, relatable character like Amuro fit right into that “introverted hero” mold that’s a proven success in storytelling worldwide. Kamille, on the other hand… He undoubtedly nails it as Zeta’s protagonist, but there’s an avant-garde, almost theatrical bent to his character. I think for the average viewer, the only part of Kamille they could really empathize with was his relationship with Fa (Yuiry).

――It’s tough to know where to place your emotional investment.

Fukui: Right, I think that’s how it came across. But the way I see it, Kamille resonated intensely with the high school kids of that generation. I mean, just a few years later, you had Yutaka Ozaki meeting a shockingly Kamille-like end. That was around the time the word “kireru” (snapping) became a buzzword. There was this pervasive sentiment of, “In this day and age, how can anyone get through high school without snapping?”

――For example, when you brought in Mineva Lao Zabi as a key character in Gundam Unicorn, was that meant to tie into the events of ZZ Gundam?

Fukui: Honestly, the thought of connecting Mineva’s role in Unicorn to ZZ hadn’t even crossed my mind until you brought it up just now. But to your earlier point, one thing I tried to be mindful of in Unicorn – and in Light of Life – was not negating anything that had appeared on-screen. We should embrace ZZ in that spirit, too. Char’s Counterattack had basically leapfrogged over ZZ entirely, which I get – they had to cram the story into a two-hour movie. But some fans took that to mean ZZ had been written out of continuity. No, no, let’s roll with all of it. The messy bits are part of Universal Century’s history, and factoring that in gives the world more depth. Plus, with such a rich tapestry of mobile suits and characters, it’d be a crying shame to let them gather dust. Granted, by taking that tack with Unicorn, the long-neglected parts may have stuck out like a sore thumb, but hey.

“So Who Won in the End?” Char’s Counterattack Leaves That Question Hanging

――Also, in Light of Life, scenes from various Gundam series are inserted regardless of chronology, but did you choose those scenes as well?

Fukui: Yes, and let me tell you, it was a beast of a task. I had zero recollection of Victory Gundam, so I had to start by rewatching the whole 50-episode run. What really threw a wrench in the works – and this is a bit of inside story – is that for F91 and Victory Gundam, at least, there were no separate audio assets with the music and dialogue split out. All that’s left is the same video footage you’d find on a consumer Blu-ray. That means any scene with music or sound effects drowning out the dialogue is unusable. When you’re trying to make a video flow seamlessly, that’s one heck of a handicap.

―― Logistics and time sink aside, did you have a hard time choosing the scenes themselves?

Fukui: I had a rough idea of the direction I wanted to take from the beginning; I mapped out the dialogue like a script, figured out where to slot in the mobile suit roundups and what kind of visuals to aim for, and then cherrypicked scenes to match. If I’d had to sit there hemming and hawing over every single clip, we’d probably still be stuck in post-production limbo! (laughs)

――It’s wild how smoothly the story flows in Light of Life, considering the timeline is all over the place.

Fukui: Part of that is just making the best of a sticky situation. If we’d tried to go in chronological order, it would’ve been a goddamn mess, especially for Gundam first-timers. I figured it’s better to treat it almost like a B-roll, letting the impressions gradually stack up as you watch.

――I got a kick out of Amuro and Lalah’s little heart-to-heart where they’re all, “Char, what a piece of work, am I right?” like an old married couple (laughs).

Fukui: Oh, Lalah’s giving off some serious “grandma from the boonies” vibes there. (laughs)

――While we’re on the subject, what’s your take on Char’s Counterattack? Light of Life spotlighted that one, too.

Fukui: I have to say, my first time watching it… This was ages after I’d moved on from Gundam, but the promise of Amuro and Char’s long-awaited final showdown reeled me back in. I knew I had to see it, so I caught it in theaters. And yes, as a fan, I dug it. But one thing kept nagging at me: when all was said and done, who actually won? It seemed like they’d moved beyond the realm of winning and losing, but that was about all I could suss out.

――At any rate, Axis didn’t fall, but…

Fukui: Bingo. (laughs) Watching Char, though – the way he’s carrying on, it’s like, why is he wound so damn tight? Pretty clear that was Tomino projecting his own headspace onto the character. You could practically hear him screaming his lungs out through Char.

The Nu Gundam is Sleek and Mature, a New Icon with Amuro at the Helm

――Next to his original Gundam self, Char does come off as way more immature.

Fukui: He really does. But you know, that actually tracks when you hit a certain age. Char’s only in his early 30s, but I bet he felt ancient like he was pushing 50. And, of course, that’s gotta be Tomino projecting himself onto the character, too. This was smack-dab in the middle of the bubble economy – everything was go-go-go, and then bam, the bottom drops out. So, as a product of its time, I’d say the film synced up eerily well with the zeitgeist.

――Even as Char spirals into madness, Amuro’s out here being the grown-up. And to match, his Nu Gundam feels like a Gundam tailor-made for adults. I remember it seeming kinda plain Jane back then, though.

Fukui: Funny you should mention that. I caught the NHK’s “Gundam General Election” special the other day, and whaddya know, the Nu Gundam clinched the top spot. Those high-end Nu Gundam figures that run you 100,000 yen a pop? Flying off the shelves faster than they can stock ’em. Sure, it might’ve looked basic at the time, but for the folks who watched Char’s Counterattack in real-time, the OG Gundam design probably feels a little, uh, let’s say juvenile now. These days, it is hard to picture yourself hopping into that cockpit. But the Nu Gundam? Slick, grown-up, Amuro’s chariot of choice – it hits that sweet spot. Boom, instant icon status.

――A Gundam for the adult crowd, then.

Fukui: No doubt about it. Plus, Char’s Counterattack got a nice boost from Unicorn’s halo effect. When Unicorn Vol. 1 dropped on Blu-ray, Char’s Counterattack moved, like, 10,000 units right alongside it. That was the beginning of the Universal Century’s 0090s era blowing up, market-wise, and Char’s Counterattack was leading the charge. You could tell it was back to raking in the dough as a property.

――Unicorn’s a tough nut to crack if you’re going in blind, sans Char’s Counterattack.

Fukui: Oh, for sure. Sitting through the original Gundam first is a pretty tall order, no lie. But I figure most folks wanna at least do their homework on this “Axis” business everyone’s always yammering about in Unicorn. The old-timers are gonna rewatch, and you’ve got your Char’s Counterattack first-timers in the mix, too. That was definitely a pattern back then.